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Old 01-22-2010, 06:39 AM
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Default Speaking in tongues

The following is presented in a Spirit of love and concern for my fellow believers. Let all thats is said and done be to the glory of Christ.

The gift of tongues, which was bestowed upon men for the first time on the day of Pentecost, was a miraculous endowment which enabled those who received it to speak in languages unfamiliar to themselves, languages they had never learned. Thereby they were empowered to declare the glad tidings to those with whom they would not have been able otherwise to communicate.
The record found in Acts 2 gives a clear description of the nature of this gift. We read that there were at Jerusalem at that season devout men "out of every nation under heaven," and that when the multitude came together, they were confounded, "because that every man heard them speak in his own language" (Acts 2:5, 6). Thus the prominent and essential characteristic of the pentecostal gift of tongues was that it enabled the disciples to address those foreigners, "every man in his own language."
Thus, in this short description, it is stated three times that the pentecostal gift of tongues was a miraculous endowment whereby those who received it were able to speak to foreigners in their own language. When, therefore, we encounter now-a-days that which purports to be the apostolical and pentecostal gift of tongues, the first thing to be ascertained is whether its reputed possessor has the supernatural ability to speak to strangers in their own language. If the supposed gift does not pass that test, it may safely, and without further inquiry, be regarded as spurious.
It should be noted that in Acts 2, and wherever the word "tongue" is used in this connection in the Scriptures, it means simply a language, just as we commonly say "the English tongue," "the French tongue," etc. In I Corinthians 14, where the expression "unknown tongue" occurs, it will be seen that the word "unknown" is printed in italics, showing that it does not occur in the original text. This supplied word has misled some. The expression means simply a foreign language. This supernatural ability to address a foreigner in his own language served also the purpose (along with other miracles which abounded at that time) of attesting this new era and this new message (the Gospel), as being from God. Without such manifestations of the presence and power of God working in and with those obscure Galilaeans, it could not have been made evident to Jews and Gentiles that God was really introducing a new order of things.
That the main purpose of miracles was to authenticate the preaching of the "great salvation, which at the first began to be spoken by the Lord," is declared in many Scriptures, as in Hebrews 2:3, 4, where we read that God also bore witness (with His preachers) by means of "signs and wonders, and with divers miracles and gifts of the Holy Ghost, according to His own will."
That such extraordinary miracles were needed at the beginning of the new era is obvious. In this respect we have a parallel, in the beginning of the era of the law, when God wrought wonderful signs and miracles in Egypt and in the wilderness. Those manifestations ceased when they had accomplished their purpose.
The second time the miraculous speaking in tongues is mentioned is in connection with Peter s preaching of the Gospel to a company of Gentiles in the home of Cornelius, the Roman Centurion, at Caesarea, which city was really a Roman city, though within the borders of Judea. Here again "was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost, for they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God" (Acts 10:45, 46). This was a convincing sign to Peter and the six Jewish converts who accompanied him, that God had indeed saved those Gentiles. Therefore, they (the Jews) did not dare "forbid water, that these should not be baptized," or refuse to receive them as brethren in Christ.
It should be particularly noted that, for another occurrence of that sort, Peter had to go back to the day of Pentecost. The inference is plain that, in all the years between, there had been no similar manifestation to which Peter could appeal. It is, therefore, very far from the truth to say, or to suppose, that all who were saved in apostolic times received the power to speak in tongues. It clearly appears, on the contrary, that the bestowal of the gift of tongues was reserved for occasions of unusual importance.
At Ephesus The third and last time the manifestation of the gift of tongues is mentioned in Acts is in chapter 19. This was outside of Palestine altogether. Paul, on coming to Ephesus, met with certain disciples who had received only so much of the truth as was connected with John s baptism. They had not received the Holy Spirit because they had not believed on the risen Jesus Christ. When, however, they were baptized in the Name of the Lord Jesus, and Paul had laid his hands upon them, then "the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spake with tongues and prophesied" (Acts 19:1-6). In this case, as in the two preceding, there was an evident need that the truth proclaimed by Paul should be specially authenticated by signs and miracles.
Please note, In none of these cases was the gift of tongues sought, nor was the Holy Spirit sought after the manner of some in the present day.
In I Corinthians, chapters 12 and 14, we read of the gift of tongues "in the church." It is mentioned among the things wrought by the Spirit, "dividing to every man severally as He will" (12:7-11). Thus the giving or not giving this (or other) gift is entirely a matter of the Divine will, which is exercised according to the Divine wisdom.
This gift is mentioned last in the list of gifts which "God hath set in the church" (12:28-29). And the apostle s questions "Have all the gifts of healing? Do all speak in tongues?" make it clear beyond all doubt that some only of the saints possessed those gifts. Indeed the questions are asked for the very purpose of enforcing the argument that, as in the human body there are many members, each with its own special function, to be exercised for the benefit of all, so in the church there are different gifts and duties as-signed to the several members; yet, inasmuch as all belong to one and the same body, the gifts all pertain to that one body, regardless of what members have them. According to the inspired argument of that chapter it would be as absurd to expect every member of the church to have the gift of tongues as to expect that every member of the human body should be a tongue endowed with power to speak (v.17).
In chapter 14 Paul shows that the gift of prophecy is far more to be desired than that of tongues, because prophesying i.e., ministering the Word of God edifies the church; and this is the work of Love, because "Love edifieth" (8:1), whereas speaking in tongues may be but the vain display of a gift. Paul makes the contrast very strong, saying, "I speak with tongues more than ye all; yet in the church I had rather speak five words with my understanding, that by my voice I might teach others also, than ten thousand words in an (unknown) tongue" (14:18, 19). So the relative value is as five to ten thousand.
He then bids those Corinthians to "be not children in understanding," and explains to them that the gift of tongues was a fulfillment of Isaiah 28:11, 12, where God, in foretelling judgments upon Israel in connection with their rejection of His Word (which had always been spoken to them in Hebrew) said, "For with stammering lips and another tongue will I speak unto this people" (the Jews) . Therefore, at Pentecost God began to speak to the Jews in "another tongue." This was a "sign" to that unbelieving people. And this is precisely what Paul declares in the next verse, where he says: "Wherefore, tongues are for a sign, not to them that believe, but to them that believe not; but prophesying serveth not for them that believe not, but for them which believe" (I Cor. 14:21). Thus the gift of prophecy is incomparably greater than that of speaking in tongues. It follows that to say the gift of tongues is a sign to believers that the one so gifted who has received the Holy Spirit, is simply to turn the Scripture upside down.
Appeal is frequently made to the words of Mark 16:17,18, as if they contained the promise that all that believe should be endowed with the gift of tongues. But the words will bear no such interpretation. They declare that certain signs, of which speaking with new tongues was one, should follow them that believe. The Lord no more promised that all believers should speak with tongues than He promised that all should cast out devils, take up serpents, and drink poison without receiving hurt. Speaking with tongues, therefore, is no more the "Bible sign" of having received the Holy Spirit than is the casting out of devils, or the taking up of serpents.
Moreover, we have only to read the 20th verse of the chapter to find the complete fulfillment of the promise of verses 17 and 18: "And they went forth and preached everywhere, the Lord working with them, and confirming the word with signs following."
This Scripture refutes "pentecostal" doctrine, for it speaks of "them that believe"; whereas, according to that doctrine, speaking in tongues is not a sign of believing, but of receiving the Spirit, which the "pentecostals" hold is a distinct thing.
Many believe that the modern error regarding tongues, as made prominent by those who call themselves "pentecostals," is one of the most dangerous of these last days. Many true, earnest, and zealous children of God have been deluded by it. The appeal it makes is very attractive to saints who groan and sigh for something different from the shams and dead formalities of religious Christendom. Its phenomena ecstasies, transports, prostrations, yielding to "the power," displaced personality, etc. are the very same as others had already become familiar with in previous investigations of hypnotism, spiritism, and other psychic and occult phenomena. It is known by personal observation some of the terrible havoc moral and spiritual it has wrought. Most earnestly, therefore, the warning must be given to the beloved people of God against it.
Blessings to all Noolie
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Old 01-24-2010, 06:17 PM
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Cool Tongues

I don't understand why Christians debate about tongues. It really doesn't matter for love is much more important. However tongues was giving simply for prayer between you and God. What man thinks, and what man thinks scripture means doesn't matter. It is simply a personal communication so that you and God can communicate without the devil knowing what you are saying. Besides man will call anything that God presents unusual not true because it challenges the mind. Our carnal minds cannot understand things which are spiritual, and because this is spiritual many do not and will never understand that tongues are meant to be personal to help in our spiritual wars against the devil. God knew that we would be attacked because we choose to speak in our heavenly language because we are still being persecuted for his name sake. Psalm 31:20
In the shelter of your presence you hide them from the intrigues of men; in your dwelling you keep them safe from accusing tongues.
Isaiah 5:24
Therefore, as tongues of fire lick up straw and as dry grass sinks down in the flames, so their roots will decay and their flowers blow away like dust; for they have rejected the law of the LORD Almighty and spurned the word of the Holy One of Israel.
Isaiah 28:11
Very well then, with foreign lips and strange tongues God will speak to this people
God simply says I will continue on speaking to my people even if others do not understand.
Jeremiah 9:5
Friend deceives friend, and no one speaks the truth. They have taught their tongues to lie; they weary themselves with sinning.
Mark 16:17
And these signs will accompany those who believe: In my name they will drive out demons; they will speak in new tongues;
1 Corinthians 12:28
And in the church God has appointed first of all apostles, second prophets, third teachers, then workers of miracles, also those having gifts of healing, those able to help others, those with gifts of administration, and those speaking in different kinds of tongues.
Out of all the gifts that were appointed tongues are the most attack however it doesn't matter because fighting scripture won't get you to heaven because God says all of these things will pass away. Only God's word survives. 1 Corinthians 13:8
Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge, it will pass away.
So no matter if you prophecy, speak in tongues, it doesn't matter God is saying these things will all pass away. Only the word stands that's all folks!
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Old 01-24-2010, 07:32 PM
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hi Noolie.. I agree with you 100%, tongues was a gift to edify the Word, not some secret language between a person and God... satan can not hear your silent prayers so we do not need a secret language... I have felt the hair on the back of my neck stand up when people talked in gibberish.... <<doctrines of men and not God... God is calling us out of Babylon, which is false worship... Gods People Hear His Voice...blessings
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Old 01-24-2010, 07:42 PM
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Default Tongues

How disappointed I am with this response by Passive. Clearly this demonstrates the twisting or gross misunderstanding of the scriptures undertaken by so many in the tongues movements. Tongues was never given to anyone as a prayer language, as you well know.
Please don't roll out the tired old Corinthians verses in an attempt to prove your point, proper exegesis of these passages, if you are willing to spend the time will reveal the truth. Tongues was given as a sign to unbelieving Jews. In any case tongues is a learned or unlearned language as demonstrated in Acts 2 not babble undertaken by so many well meaning yet deluded christians today. Any careful examination of the scripture undertaken without bias and without a predetermined viewpoint will show this clearly to be the case. Nowhere in scripture does an angel speak to anyone in any form of language other than that which is understod by the person being visited. Some of the comments in your reply I simply will not dignify with a response. Here is the challenge to those who claim to have this so called gift, are you certain which spirit is operating in this, how do you know, and have you had the tongue tested, if not, why not, are we not told to test the spirits? The simple truth is that this tongues movement is not restricted to the Christian faith, and certainly was not something new at pentecost. All major faith systems have had this happen or are still using tongues, really we must ask ourselves why is this the case. The counterfeit arguement does not wash here.
Please understand I am not saying that tongues is all demonic, God is able to do what He wishes when he wishes, our God is too great to be placed in some box. What I am calling for is a sober and careful examination of this whole movement. I concider those involved to be my christian brothers and sisters thus I have a concern and love for them and their spiritual health as they, I am sure, have for me. But please if we are going to discuss this lets use proper Hermeneutics and exegesis and lets not involve ourselves in eisegesis and rampant emotion. Those of you who know me know I do not not wish to cause schism in the church, but what harm does it cause to seek the truth in spiritual matters? Surely to discuss these things is good for the health of the churches and this way we will be able to grow in truth to the glory of God.
Blessings to all Noolie

Last edited by noolie; 01-24-2010 at 07:50 PM.
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Old 01-25-2010, 01:23 PM
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The gift of tongues can only be appreciated...Not understood nor explained away.. the proof is the manifested power of God that is released in your life when you step out in faith and receive the baptism of the Holy Spirit and fire with the evidence of speaking in tongues... If you have not experienced it, it is only because you have not received it... but it is freely offered to anyone who wants it...I loved the story of the baptist preacher on the Miracle Channel a couple of days ago who said he preached fervently against tongues for many years, until the day the Spirit of the Lord fell on him in his bedroom and he woke up speaking a heavenly language... his church is now led by the Holy Spirit working through him in power and he loves telling his story... One could spend many words and explanations, but for those filled with this unexplainable, supernatural phenomenon, the proof is in the puddin'!
with Love, in Christ,
Deb
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Old 01-25-2010, 04:55 PM
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Default Initial tongues of the spirit

Read acts 2:8 KJV the active words concerning tongues is, tongues in which we were born. Now unless you were speaking english the first day you were born into this world it's not a language you were born with but one you've learned there after. You miss read scripture. If I was born speaking english I would have asked the doctor not to smack my behind while being turned up side down. Go back to the creation of man you will find we were made in God's image,and if we have a mouth and a tongue, so the God the holy Ghost has a mouth and a language too. How would you feel if I were to tell you that I believe in you but you don't have a mouth or a tongue? Known languages are not new but have exsisted sence the tower of babble. Tongues of the spirit were a sign to them that believe of the infilling of the holy ghost. These signs shall follow them that believe they shall speak with new tongues, a tongue much like that we were born with. This same tongue is not the gift of tongues.

The gift of tongues is the holy spirit speaking in known earthly languages unknown by the person speaking to preach the good news to those of a different language.

Last edited by RFeasel; 01-25-2010 at 05:50 PM.
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Old 01-25-2010, 08:06 PM
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I thank those who have replied here. However, as today is Australia day, a national hoilday and one of the few days each year I can have off I do not intend to reply today. This may be to the advantage of the two latest replies as it will give them the option to review what thay have written. To them I say do you really want to continue to display to the world what you have put down, perhaps you would like to take this time to think it through a little. One gladly states this tongues movement cannot be understood but must be experienced, are you sure you want that to remain posted. The other accuses me of miss reading scripture and then goes on to talk about smacking babies bottoms etc, and then talks about humans being made in the image of God saying the spirit has a tongue and mouth and so on, lol, I miss understand scripture?????? Here is your chance to rethink these statements. Blessings to all and I will reply later.
Happy Australia day

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Old 01-25-2010, 08:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by noolie View Post
I thank those who have replied here. However, as today is Australia day, a national hoilday and one of the few days each year I can have off I do not intend to reply today. This may be to the advantage of the two latest replies as it will give them the option to review what thay have written. To them I say do you really want to continue to display to the world what you have put down, perhaps you would like to take this time to think it through a little. One gladly states this tongues movement cannot be understood but must be experienced, are you sure you want that to remain posted. The other accuses me of miss reading scripture and then goes on to talk about smacking babies bottoms etc, and then talks about humans being made in the image of God saying the spirit has a tongue and mouth and so on, lol, I miss understand scripture?????? Here is your chance to rethink these statements. Blessings to all and I will reply later.



Happy Australia day

There is nothing to rethink, if you wish to turn words around and miss quote what I said to create another doctrine that's up to you. I explained three major issues in that which I wrote. Common sence explains each one.
1) God the Holy Ghost has a spiritual tongue as well as our mortal bodys have a tongue.We were made in his image.
2) Acts 2:8 active decerned words were: tongue we were born with.
8And how hear we every man in our own tongue, (wherein we were born?)
3) Was the explaination of the tongue in which we were born with (a baby is not born speaking in a earth known language)
4)This same prayer language is not the gift of tongues.

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Old 01-25-2010, 09:34 PM
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What love is this? What theology? What anger? Why the insults? Are we not all children of Christ? Why can we not debate in love?I wonder of the wisdom to continue this when such things abound. Can it be that with sound theology and reasoned debate some are moved to fall and anger, how sad. I call for reasoned debate and find myself accused of miss reading scripture and now making up doctrine. I should have known when the tongues movement have no scriptial arguement they would turn to personal insult and emotion or feelings to explain their position. Ok fair enough but lets debate the issue not the person. You know full well that babies bottoms have nothing to do with the issue at hand. I post this for you to assist you to see the error kai. pw/j h`mei/j avkou,omen e[kastoj th/| ivdi,a| diale,ktw| h`mw/n evn h-| evgennh,qhmenČ. The fact that you make a statement does not make it so as seen above. Be sure of what you have written before you accuse. As I stated earlier I will reply in full later.
May the Lord Bless you greatly
In Christian love Noolie
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Old 01-26-2010, 09:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by noolie View Post
I thank those who have replied here. However, as today is Australia day, a national hoilday and one of the few days each year I can have off I do not intend to reply today. This may be to the advantage of the two latest replies as it will give them the option to review what thay have written. To them I say do you really want to continue to display to the world what you have put down, perhaps you would like to take this time to think it through a little. One gladly states this tongues movement cannot be understood but must be experienced, are you sure you want that to remain posted. The other accuses me of miss reading scripture and then goes on to talk about smacking babies bottoms etc, and then talks about humans being made in the image of God saying the spirit has a tongue and mouth and so on, lol, I miss understand scripture?????? Here is your chance to rethink these statements. Blessings to all and I will reply later.
Happy Australia day



How do you think I'm going to respond when my words are miss quoted in a rude way, talk about a lack of love? I can't help you when common sence offends you. When we forget our bodily members is forgotten when God the holy ghost is the toppic of conversation, for we are made in God's image. Too many people condem tongues or consider the language to be some sort of gift? Do you consider your foot to be a gift over your leg to the rest of your body? These are absurd beliefs That makes no sence, creatiion has a big part of all scripture, and our relationship with God.
The same warfare exsists from evolution verses creation, to God the holy ghost by cutting tongues one of the bodily members from him cause of lack of faith or understanding, and common sence.
God the Holy ghost is a spirit That we cannot see mortally and without all his manifestations in their fullness we wouldn't know without a dought whether we were baptised in the holy ghost or not.

Last edited by RFeasel; 01-26-2010 at 09:34 AM.
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